FOX NEWS

Friday, June 3, 2011

KLAVAN'S ONE STATE SOLUTION

Posted by Catawissa Gazetteer at 9:24 AM
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13 comments:

  1. salvageJune 3, 2011 at 3:05 PM

    I thought I will watch it until something stupid is said.

    I got about 10 seconds in.

    Obama did not propose anything, he re-iterated a long standing U.S. and UN policy. Bush and Clinton and Bush and Reagean all said the same thing and it went unremarked, Obama says it and suddenly he is Hitler KKK Jewkiller.

    Tell me, (or ignore me which seems to be your new SOP) are you one of those Christians who is keen on Israel because you believe your sky god takes an active interest in the geopolitical affairs of its creation and is waiting for the Jews to run all of Israel before it destroys the world killing and then torturing everyone who doesn't think like you?

    Or you just hate Muslims and like anything that is against them?

    Hmm it can actually be both.

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  2. Catawissa GazetteerJune 3, 2011 at 3:25 PM

    I'm not ignoring you more than anything else on the computer these days - you're just not that special. It's summer and I've got better things to do.

    I support Israel because I support Israel. They've been good friends and good allies. Maybe it's because I grew up in a neighborhood with lots of Jewish friends. I don't know. Do I think that as a Catholic I should support Israel? Yep. Do I believe like the Evangelicals that I should support Israel to try and hasten some sort of "rapture"? No.

    We, and by that I mean the West, have kicked the Jews around long enough. We owe them our support. And Israel and America are joined through our actions in Israel's creation as a modern state.

    I don't...why am I even bothering...hate Muslims. I do think that Islam is a horribly flawed belief system. But I don't really care about that. What I do care about is that Muslims all around the world seem bent on jihad against the West. And since very few Muslims ever stand against it I assume that most are with it.

    That I do hate.

    Now I'm going back to not paying attention again.

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  3. salvageJune 4, 2011 at 8:42 AM

    >I support Israel because I support Israel. They've been good friends and good allies.

    Uh huh:

    Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu appealed to U.S. President Barack Obama to grant clemency to imprisoned spy Jonathan Pollard in a letter he then read publicly in Israel's parliament on Tuesday.

    ----

    The Foreign and Commonwealth Office confirmed that the identities used by six members of the 11-strong hit squad were those of real British passport holders living in Israel. “We believe the passports used were fraudulent, and have begun our own investigation,” a spokesman said.

    (They've pulled this sort of stunt with Canadian and New Zealand passports as well for the last 30 years or so, each time they're caught they swear they won't do it again until the next time they're caught.)

    --------

    The FBI has accused Israel of being one of the major players in industrial espionage that cost the United Sta, Despite passage of the 1996 Economic Espionage Act, the FBI says foreign spies have stepped up their attacks on U.S.-based companies.

    >Maybe it's because I grew up in a neighborhood with lots of Jewish friends.

    LOL! So you support a whole nation based on knowing people who have the same religion / culture as that state's official?

    I grew up in a Jewish Zionist house, I was sent to Israel in my teens to live there for a bit. Left with the scales right off my eyes and an atheist as a result.

    One of the many themes I was brought up with was the world did nothing for us in the 1930s (None is Too Many was the policy for Jews fleeing Europe's Christian backed genocide) so we owe the world nothing. The spying and stealing above is a result of that attitude. Israel's only allies is Israel as far as many Jews are concerned and the Holocaust justifies any and all lies and dishoners.

    >We, and by that I mean the West, have kicked the Jews around long enough.

    Yeah, the Jewish people were the only victims of genocide at the hands of the West and that totally justifies any kicking around of weaker peoples they might do.

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  4. salvageJune 4, 2011 at 8:43 AM

    >in Israel's creation as a modern state.

    Modern apartheid state. When I was there I found what I thought was a passport, I brought it to the guy from the Kibutz that drove us to town. He told me that we needed to get it to the police right away, it was the identity documents of a Palestinian and if he didn't have them on him he could be arrested.

    "Do you have to carry one?" I asked not getting the concept. He looked uncomfortable and annoyed and said no, he was Jewish, he didn't have to.

    Jews demanding papers of a minority under their power with the threat of imprisonment, I was still a bit too green to appreciate the full irony but on a level I saw the rot. Oh and I met so many Israelis who would cheerfully start up their own Auschwitz on the West Bank. They think the crime of being born in Israel of Muslims is certainly worthy of death or exile.

    >What I do care about is that Muslims all around the world seem bent on jihad against the West.

    No, no they are not; once again you seem to have trouble with reality. Once again how many Muslim nations have invaded Western ones in the last 100 years? How many Muslims nations are under occupation of Western powers right now? a sliver of Muslim minorities certainly are but the majority of Westerners like yourself cheer on all sorts of jihad.
    And again, holy war is how Christianity rolled for most of its existence.

    Facts! Why can't you grasp them?

    >. And since very few Muslims ever stand against it I assume that most are with it.

    And since very few Catholics stand against the rape of children I assume that most are with it.

    Whenever you assume you are correct!

    I love this whole group-think you seem to think of Muslims, like they're a giant hive-mind, each the same as the last. Nope, no racism there! All Blacks are crack dealing thives, all Jews cheap misers, all Irish drunks and everyone from Missouri a Bible thumping and sister humping hick!

    Reality: This was Iran on the day after 9-11:

    http://www.time.com/time/europe/photoessays/vigil/

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  5. Catholic KnightJune 5, 2011 at 10:11 PM

    With the highest respect toward my fellow Missouri Catholic blogger, I would just like to say there is more than one way for a Catholic to look at this topic - Catholics Cannot Be Zionists

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  6. Catawissa GazetteerJune 8, 2011 at 7:58 AM

    Knight,

    I agree with most of what you posted on your blog but that still doesn't change my opinion, which is mostly political, not religious (though my religious beliefs do heavily influence my political thought), that the Middle East would be better under Jewish rule. Perfect? No. Just better.

    Salvage,

    Nearly all Catholics stand against the rape of children, women and everything else in this regard you can think of. We are not happy with the way the Vatican has handled this crap. And yes, many, many have stood up, some for honorable reasons and some for others. Groups like S.N.A.P. (though I think that they may have less then honorable goals in some respects). Show me the Muslim groups that are standing up and loudly challenging the leaders of their faith. You talk to the average Catholic in the pews and they'll gladly turn in anyone that goes after kids. This is a problem inside the leadership, not the laity. How many Catholics have you seen on TV supporting child rape? Now ask yourself how many Muslims you've seen cheering on the bombers and crazy Mullahs.

    Does every Muslim support radical Islam? I doubt it. But until I see or read something that shows me different I believe that radicalism is ascending while peaceful coexistence is barely considered among the Muslims. Look at what's happening now in Egypt after their revolution.

    I'm not a Zionist and I've heard the sentiments that you've described from many in the Orthodox Jewish community. But then I've heard the same kind of crap coming from the other side among Christians that believe Jews are at the bottom of every evil known to man.

    Believe it or not I have Muslim friends. And, believe it or not, even they are hesitant to condemn the attacks on America. Most seem torn. And they're Americans. So when I see Muslims in other places dancing in the streets after we're attacked it doesn't surprise me.

    Your question about Muslim nations is misleading. Though they support terrorism they seldom attack as a nation, they just pull the strings. They use proxies to do their dirty work. Small cells attacking small targets. Whether churches in Egypt, vessels in port or buildings in New York these attacks occur. And the attacks that happen all over the world are not the result of some giant, amorphous movement of the spirit. They're being driven and inflamed by radical Muslim clerics in madrassas' supported by governments, most notably our "friends" in Saudi Arabia.

    Really, I would prefer that I didn't even have to think about Israel and the rest of the world. I'd prefer that we all get along and go our own ways. I'd prefer that America disengage from the rest of the world, dial back our consumptive lifestyle, learn to live on what we produce, pull up the drawbridge and tell everybody to kiss our ass. I'll gladly go back to heating with wood (I do it anyway) and walking to where I have to go. I love steam engines and they work just fine. I'll go back to living in the 1890's anytime. But since mine is definitely the minority view I suppose that I have to pay attention and in some cases choose sides.

    As things are now I'll choose Israel, not because I think it's perfect or for religious reasons but because I think Jewish rule of the Middle East would probably give me the best chance of not seeing at least a modicum of peace in this world.

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  7. AnonymousJune 8, 2011 at 9:27 AM

    Catty, a Jew led Middle East would be as much a diaster as a Muslim led one. The Zionists are just as anti-christian as the Muslims. If they were to achieve their goal of expanding to Israel's ancient borders, they would turn their eyes toward us. After all, Zionism is a ideology of racist and nationalist supremacy, just like Islam. Like Paul said, "they are adversaries to all men" IThess 2:15. ScotJu

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  8. AnonymousJune 9, 2011 at 8:41 AM

    Jewish (Zionist) rule will not bring a modicum of peace to the Middle East. Zionism is a power-hungry, expansionist ideology, just like Islam. If they were to achieve their goal of borders from the river of Egypt to the Euphrates, they would use Israel as a base to build themselves up as a world power that would threaten the rest of us. Hundreds of years of Talmudic brainwashing that tells them everybody hates them because they are Jews, will guarantee a paranoid mindset that will be very dangerous, especially when 400 nclear weapons are at it's disposal. No, the Middle East will only have a modicum of peace when Islam and Zionism are permanently defanged, and Christianity becomes the dominant religion in the Middle East. Scotju

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  9. salvageJune 26, 2011 at 9:49 AM

    >Nearly all Catholics stand against the rape of children, women and everything else in this regard you can think of. We are not happy with the way the Vatican has handled this crap.

    "not happy"? The enabling of the rape of children made you "not happy"? Most people with a sense of morality and justice would be enraged at the very least ah but since it's the gatekeepers of paradise you can't let yourself get too upset can ya? Wouldn't want to risk your immortal soul for or anything huh?

    And there it is, the reality, it doesn't matter what crimes your religion commits you will be its slave forever as the heart and power of slavery is fear and that's what your god needs.

    > Show me the Muslim groups that are standing up and loudly challenging the leaders of their faith.

    Which leaders? The ones that condemn terrorism as most of them do? Show me the Muslim Pope, what does he say? Oh, wait, there isn't one.

    You don't even know how Islam works, you can't think beyond your own.

    >You talk to the average Catholic in the pews and they'll gladly turn in anyone that goes after kids.

    Then they plunk 20 bucks into the offering plate (cuz the Vatican is soooo poor! Why the only have the one bank!). If that were true every Catholic Church connected to the Vatican would be empty, there are different ways to "go after" you know.

    Once again you ignore reality in favor of the delusions that sustain you.

    > This is a problem inside the leadership, not the laity.

    Remove the laity and where does that leave the leadership? Ah but sheep can't leave the fold, too much fear.
    >How many Catholics have you seen on TV supporting child rape?

    Well that fat mouthpiece for the Bill Donahue for one, he doesn't support it he just says that the gays did it all, the Vatican recently blamed the 60s and those darned hippies. They don't support it but they support their church and the power and money it generates far more than any justice so that is as close to supporting the rape of children as one can get without actually doing it.

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  10. salvageJune 26, 2011 at 9:50 AM

    >How many Catholics have you seen on TV supporting child rape?

    Well that fat mouthpiece for the Bill Donahue for one, he doesn't support it he just says that the gays did it all, the Vatican recently blamed the 60s and those darned hippies. They don't support it but they support their church and the power and money it generates far more than any justice so that is as close to supporting the rape of children as one can get without actually doing it.

    >Now ask yourself how many Muslims you've seen cheering on the bombers and crazy Mullahs.

    None, I saw a few Palestinians dancing in the streets on 9-11 but the majority of Muslims around them shut that down ASAP. None of the Muslims I know cheered it and considering the number one victim of Muslims terrorists is Muslim it would be odd to find support amongst their numbers.


    >But until I see or read something that shows me different I believe that radicalism is ascending while peaceful coexistence is barely considered among the Muslims.

    Ha! Ha! Yes! Just like evolution! No, you are uninterested in facts no matter what medium caries them, there is plenty that shows just that but you won't read it and if you do you simply won't believe it. You need to be the "good guys" and anyone who thinks otherwise must be the bad guys.

    Your Pope told raped children if they tell anyone about their rape he will see them sent to hell.

    This is not made up, this is a fact. A FACT supported by documentation from the Vatican. A FACT. That should be more than enough for anyone to understand where the Vatican's motivation is in all things and lead to its abandonment and yet there you all are, muttering excuses and shrugging your shoulders because you live in terror of your god and will risk nothing that may garner its wrath.

    >Look at what's happening now in Egypt after their revolution.

    Yes, the exact same thing that was happening before for the last 10,000 years. Hey did you know that the first Christian on Christian war between the Aryans and the prototype Catholics happened in North Africa? Do you know what their religious differences were? Have you ever read the history of your Church? No dark conspiracy, the real actual history?

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  11. salvageJune 26, 2011 at 9:51 AM

    >Believe it or not I have Muslim friends. And, believe it or not, even they are hesitant to condemn the attacks on America.

    Ha! Ha! Yes! Lie to me, I love it when Christians do.

    But let's play along, they weren't hesitant to condemn the attacks, they understood why America was a target, because of the endless meddling in the Middle East for America's own ends. You sell weapons to someone's enemies and then act all shocked when they count you amongst their foes?
    Have ya noticed that nations that don't mess around in the Middle East don't get attacked? Coincidence?!!?

    Your alleged Muslim friends merely saw the big picture you of course cannot do that for fear of understanding that maybe you're not amongst the pure as you imagine.

    >Your question about Muslim nations is misleading. Though they support terrorism they seldom attack as a nation, they just pull the strings.

    No, it's pointed. America has wrecked far more havoc on the Middle East than any terrorist has in America. Gosh, another fact you try and delude your way around.

    >They use proxies to do their dirty work.

    Ya mean like how the CIA armed the Afghans in the 80s?
    Ya mean like how the Reagan Administration armed the Contras in the 90s?
    Ya mean like how every American government has done since the 1800s?

    I know, I know, they're the good guys, when they do it it's good!

    > pull up the drawbridge and tell everybody to kiss our ass.

    Gosh, you sound just like Jesus there! Isolationism, is there any unrealistic philosophy you don't subscribe to?

    >think Jewish rule of the Middle East would probably give me the best chance of not seeing at least a modicum of peace in this world.

    HAHAHQAWHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH! Oh man, you are deeply silly.

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  12. salvageJune 29, 2011 at 4:57 PM

    This is from your buddy Knight's thread, he doesn't have the spheres as you do to post my comments so I have to address it here.

    >You're right, the South will rise again.

    And what? Bring back slavery?

    Oh and it never "rose" in the first place and it would have been slapped down a lot faster save for some tactical errors and politics that got in the way.

    >he part that just wanted to be left alone.

    Yeah, left alone with their slaves. Oh let me guess, you're one of those who thinks that slavery weren't so bad, the Negroes had it pretty good, free food and board not in the jungle etc. etc.

    Well to be fair your god and Bible do approve of slavery so I guess I can see why you'd be keen on its return.

    As for the rest of your backwards longing for a simpler time when people died from scratches, women were treated as property and other "simpler" things we'll go back to that only if something horrific happens like nuclear war or Yellowstone's super volcano blows up.

    Guess I know what you're cheering for.

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  13. Catawissa GazetteerJune 29, 2011 at 9:38 PM

    Jeez, are you stalking me? It's not worth it; I'm old, fat and bald. Chase a Victoria's Secret girl instead.

    I'm pretty much done with the whole blogging thing so I'm posting your stuff but generally not replying. My simple, agrarian life just takes too much time out of my day.

    Yes, I do long for a simpler life, one closer to the land and yes with less comfort, at least as it's defined today, and technology. I realize the trade offs involved, I know a scratch can kill you....dude, I get it. I also know that if we were to combine our knowledge of hygiene and all the other things we've learned over the last hundred years or so with a simpler way of life we could conquer many of the things that killed us without the massive technology that surrounds us today.

    I try as best as I can to live as simply as possible. I can almost go completely without electricity now. Actually, I could go completely without it but since it's still available I use it. I think that this is our future so we might as well get used to it. Without massive amounts of cheap energy (oil), we're going to return to, eventually, the 1880's-90's. I don't know that I buy into the whole peak oil thing but I do believe that the days of cheap, sweet crude are over and with them so is the life we've all grown accustomed to. And I believe that there will be incredible turmoil as the oil shuts off. It's not something I wish for or desire, I just don't see any way around it.

    Think about it. Without oil we lose the engine that drove the 20th century. We don't need a nuclear war or super volcano. All we need is for the pumps to turn off. Without oil we lose the ability to make the insulation for the high power transmission wires that move our power. We can't put fuel in the trucks to service the power system. We can't move food across the country to fill the stores. The military stops. Our factories shut down. The farmers can't farmer thousands of acres. The pesticides and fertilizers that allow industrial farming disappear. You probably won't even have a reliable source of drinking water. Without oil the economy shrinks...and collapses.

    So you can laugh, ridicule or whatever suits you but there you have it. I'm preparing for tough times and I'd suggest that you do too. But that's up to you. Good luck, my friend.

    Like I said, I probably won't be replying much or posting very often if at all.

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